Presenter: Secretary of Defense Donald H. Rumsfeld Thursday, February 26, 2004
Secretary Rumsfeld Joint Availability with Afghan President Karzai
(Participating were Secretary of Defense Donald H. Rumsfeld and Afghan President Hamid Karzai. This availability was
held at the Presidential Palace, Kabul, Afghanistan.)
Karzai: Ladies and Gentlemen (Coughs.), excuse me, we had a heavy lunch. An excellent, excellent lunch. I am very happy
to have Secretary Rumsfeld for the fifth time or the sixth time? Fifth time I believe. Sixth time? Sixth time, lets take
it to the sixth time in Afghanistan in the past two years. The only difference this time is that he followed in Mrs.
Rumsfeld’s footsteps, and she stayed for three days. He is here only for a day, but of course he has things to do back
in America. We discussed the continuation of the cooperation that the two countries have in matters related to the fight
against terrorism, the building of the Afghan defense forces, and the institutional building in Afghanistan. We
discussed about the progress that Afghanistan has made, and the future needs of Afghanistan, and the continued U.S.
assistance with Afghanistan. We were reassured once again, as in the past occasions, that America would stay with
Afghanistan until Afghanistan is firmly, firmly on its own feet with regard to its own defense forces. With regard to
its own capabilities to defend itself in the fight against terror to secure its borders. We welcome him once again to
Afghanistan, and we cherish the relationship that we have established with the United States and with the Secretary of
Defense Mr. Rumsfeld in securing a better future for our people. Thank you.
Rumsfeld: I’m delighted to be back. I’m told it is my sixth visit. And in each case I’ve been impressed with the
progress I’ve seen. The excitement and the energy one sees in this growing city. I certainly want to congratulate you
and your team for contributing so much to the energy that I’ve seen. Think about it: two and a half years and
Afghanistan has been liberated. Twenty-five million Afghans have been freed from tyranny. Because of the bond process
Afghans have taken hold of this country and are making steady progress on the path to self government and to self
reliance. With the training of the Afghan National Army, and the police now under way, Afghans are taking an increasing
role in providing in their own security, and that’s impressive. Last year to support our decision to accelerate
reconstruction the President requested, and Congress authorized, some 1.7 billion dollars in assistance for Afghanistan.
Since then, coalition countries have established now a dozen Provincial Reconstruction Teams they are I think another
five or six that are en route. Your central government is extending its reach in a positive and constructive way and has
been energizing the provincial governments which is, I think, exceedingly important. With the regional strategy, Afghan
and coalition forces are now conducting joint operations against terrorists and then following up immediately with
focused reconstruction assistance. Last month with the successful completion of the Constitutional Loya Jirga the Afghan
people approved a new constitution, and equally important, the world had an opportunity to see that process take place,
and to see the debate, discussion, the free exchange of views, the compromises that took place and the progress -- a
constitution that protects the rights of all citizens of Afghanistan, including Afghan women who have made such
substantial gains since the defeat of the Taliban regime. Direct presidential elections are being prepared now for later
this year. All of this has been accomplished in two and a half years. In a country that for some decades had known
tyranny, occupation, and war it’s a remarkable transformation. This morning we were in Kandahar, and had a chance to
visit the provincial reconstruction team there, to meet with Governor Pashtoon. I was impressed personally with the
progress that’s being made with that PRT. It only started I think in November. They have accomplished a number of
projects, and have many more under way. As I have said to you personally, our coalition is committed to helping the
Afghan people succeed as they tackle the task of building a new nation under your leadership. I mentioned to you that
last month I was in Munich with the NATO ministers of defense, and there is a great deal of support in the NATO alliance
for continuing to assist Afghanistan in it’s security area, and increasingly so over the coming months, and I suspect
years. The free world has a stake in Afghanistan’s success. This country has gone in a short period form a haven for
terrorists to a coalition ally in the war against terrorism. Freedom is clearly taking root in this country, and
Afghanistan is on a path to become a model for freedom and moderation in the Muslim world. Thank you, sir.
Q: The Pakistani Military has sharply increased their cooperation in the tribal areas and along the border. I’d ask you
sir is the task broken or has Osama been ridden?
Rumsfeld: Well, one would certainly hope so.
Q: Are you closer to the capture?
Rumsfeld: We’ve talked about this for two or three years now. Close doesn’t count. The world will be a better place when
he is captured or killed. That is the goal of a great many nations. Ninety nations in the global war on terror, and it
will happen when it happens, and I don’t believe it’s closer or farther at any given moment. All I know is there are
wonderful people in lots of countries who are demonstrating a seriousness of purpose and a great deal of skill. And the
intent is there, and suspect we’ll accomplish that at some point in the future, and I wouldn’t have any idea when.
Q: Following up on that, what are the group thoughts on the hunt for Osama Bin Laden? Do you believe he is in Pakistan,
and what do you think it will take to capture Hekmatyer?
Rumsfeld: I’m not going to speculate as to whether he’s in Pakistan or Afghanistan, or in any other country. I can say
that we are looking for him. The Americans, the Afghans, the Pakistanis, and those that are in the coalition with us. I
would have a remark on him once we’ve captured him.
Q: Have you brought more troops into the country -- specifically have you used troops in border operations?
Rumsfeld: First of all we don’t talk about what we do with our troops for the most part, nor do we talk about
operations, but we move troops around the world on a daily basis at different levels and it is nothing new or notable.
The central command is under the leadership of John Abizaid, and we work with him so that he has the kinds of forces,
and the number of forces he believes he needs in his entire area of operation.
Q: We’re a bit concerned about the number of outcasts who are already registered to vote and you expressed some doubts.
Secretary Rumsfeld just said something “later this year.” Can you clarify that for us?
Karzai: We are together with the United Nations and the countries helping us in the matter of elections to register by
the end of May, that’s June, 10 million Afghans for election. Today we have a little over 1.4 million Afghans
registered. If this trend continues we’ll have in another month or twenty days or more 2 million Afghans registered.
Once we recognized that the time was short and that we had to fulfill the promises made in bone and the legitimacy
granted to us by the Loya Jirga of the voting in Afghanistan to June of 2004, we prepared with the United Nations a
massive technically strong plan to prepare until the end of April to launch 4,000, 200 locations, 12 thousand
registration sites with the help of 30,000 people to go and register. Both men and women all over the country and to
fulfill the registration of eight million other Afghans in that period. We are strongly hopeful that this will succeed
this plan. It’s a massive plan. Now, if by the end of May -- the beginning of June -- we don’t have 10 million Afghans
registered, we will sit down and think if it is right to go for elections or not. Because we must have the people who
are franchise age, voting age. We must have them register. The enthusiasm in the Afghan people for registration is
strong in them. They keep asking us every day as to when and how are the registration people going to be in contact with
them. So we have the platform ready for it, which is the willingness and the desire for it for the people to register
and participate in voting. We must prepare, and implement, and succeed in the other part of it, which is the
technicality of freeing the people to register. If we complete that, we will have elections on time.
Q: What about security?
Karzai: Security, in my mind -- we don’t consider that a problem. Security will remain a problem in Afghanistan today,
it will be there in June, it will be there in July, it will be there in October, and next year perhaps too. Afghanistan
and the world is not going to be a 100 percent secure place in one or two or three years time. So security is not a
concern. Security was not a concern when we were preparing for the Loya Jirga elections. But we did it, and there was
over 85 percent participation. Now regardless of that we are going to work for elections, and we hope if we are
technically able to have it on time. Otherwise we go to the Afghan people and explain, and we’ll have it later. Security
has never been in my mind on this. It has been the technical problem of how and what manner to reach the Afghan people.
Q: After three years of fighting against the Taliban, how much of a threat is the Taliban now?
Rumsfeld: Well, I suppose it be a better question to pose to President Karzai or General Barno who’s here, but I’ve not
seen any indication that the Taliban pose a military threat to Afghanistan. I think the situations are so different,
that to equate them is probably not a good idea. On the other hand, terrorists are terrorists. Terrorists tend to engage
in killing innocent men, women, and children. They tend to avoid trying to take on military capabilities that they know
they can’t handle. And that’s why it takes a variety of techniques to go after the terrorists, where they are and to
prevent them form killing innocent people. But I think trying to connect the two situations probably is not a useful
thing.
Karzai: Let me add something to that. Everything that happens in Afghanistan is not terrorist related. Lack of security
times is not Taliban related or terrorist related. There is banditry too, there is theft too. There is armed robbery
too. Now every act that is committed by a Kalishnkov is not an act done either by the Taliban or al Qaeda. Sometimes
it’s theft. Sometimes it’s institutional weakness. A lot of times we have noticed wrongs committed by people that are
working for the government. So in Afghanistan, as far as terrorism is concerned, the Taliban are concerned, we strongly
believe with evidence that they are defeated. They are gone. The terrorist that killed 19 children in Kandahar -- and
then he tried to hide in somebody’s house -- the woman in that house brought him out of hiding, and delivered him to the
police. Likewise, there are four or five incidents in the past three months were people have arrested a terrorist and
delivered him to the police. In Ghazni, where the French lady was killed, and on other occasions we don’t see a
resurgence of the Taliban. The Taliban as a movement does not exist any more. You’d be surprised if I disclosed to you
as to how many approaches we have form the Taliban on a daily basis. Individuals, groups coming back to talk to us to
let them back into the country to just have them back in Afghanistan. Or those who are in Afghanistan. I asked the
governor of Oruzgan, I said “How much of what you have is terrorist Taliban related, how much of what you have is
something else?” He told me that he does not see a Taliban threat anymore. So in Afghanistan, we don’t have it as you
think of it, as the media thinks of it. There are terrorist incidents. There are Taliban related activities. Sure, but
the rest of it is normal life. Like a crime taking place in London, or in Shanghai, or in Washington. On an average
Afghanistan is much more secure than other countries that you might think of in the world. I’m not going to compare
Kabul to Washington. Probably you are more secure here than in Washington in terms of the crime on a daily basis and
things like that. I’m not going to challenge him on that. But Kabul, Afghanistan, is more secure than lots of other
capitals. So it’s not terrorist related, and I think we have won that war against terrorism. What we are going against
is the pursuit of them. We are going to take them and finish them completely for a better Afghanistan.
Q: (Inaudible.)
Rumsfeld: I did that once, and I was advised that it wasn’t the best idea. But there are hundreds of homicides in most
major cities in the world without getting particular.
Karzai: Exactly, and let me add to that. The security that we have today in Kabul is because the president of ISAF and
the international coalition forces. That has to be acknowledged.
Q: Are you seeing any reaction to the Pakistani president with al Qaeda moving across the border anything along those
lines?
Rumsfeld: Well I must say I think the efforts that are being made in Pakistan by the Pakistan government to track down
terrorists are encouraging, and constructive and in a number of instances they’ve been successful.
Q: Was there a reaction to the al Qaeda?
Rumsfeld: I don’t know that I could answer that. Clearly there’s pressure being put on terrorists. All over the world,
but most recently, and with a great deal of energy, and some success in Pakistan, for which we are very grateful.
Q: Secretary, you’ve been in Europe meeting with NATO leaders, has there been any progress in the effort to get them to
move more troops to Afghanistan? Some Afghans are concerned about the possible flagging interests by Europe both
nationally and militarily in helping Afghanistan? Quick question for Mr. Karzai: Any plans being made in meeting with
Makital?
Rumsfeld: The meeting I had in Munich with the Defense Ministers of NATO suggested and indicated a good deal of support
on the part of the NATO nations for participation here in Afghanistan. It was an enormous step for NATO to take over the
ISAF responsibility here. It was the first time in the history of the alliance that they’d done something outside of
Europe and outside of the NATO treaty area, and it was a big step. They have now indicated that they want to expand that
somewhat outside of Kabul and now have talked about the Konduz PRT. During the course of my meetings there I talked to
any number of members of the alliance, and the partnership for peace countries, and they committed to another five
provincial reconstruction teams. I see the interest as high and I see the contributions as growing.
Karzai: On meeting with Makital, we have daily approaches by the Taliban leaders both those that were in Afghanistan,
and those that were in Pakistan who want to come back and stay in Afghanistan who recognize that Afghanistan is now a
better place for all of us to live in, and they want to benefit from this opportunity provided by the new Afghanistan.
Like Makatil, there have been other approaches that have come to us from various leaders of them. Mr. Makatil sent us a
letter about six months ago or five months ago, and we asked some people from the Afghan government to meet with them.
In that letter, Mr. Matakil has asked to meet with me. I have not yet considered that, but we are thinking of how we
should deal with these matters. We have had a number of meetings in the National Security Council. Generally, I should
tell you that all those Taliban who were not involved in al Qaeda or terrorism and who have not committed crimes in
Afghanistan or elsewhere in the world are free to return to their country and live a normal life. The ones that have
linkages to terrorism and al Qaeda, or are members of al Qaeda and have committed crimes, they are not welcome, and that
number is very limited. The rest of them are welcome to back to their country. Thank you very much.
ENDS