Cablegate: Ambassador Meets with Religious Affairs Committee

This record is a partial extract of the original cable. The full text of the original cable is not available.

UNCLAS SECTION 01 OF 04 HANOI 002534

SIPDIS

SENSITIVE

DEPT PASS TO EAP/MLS; DRL/IRF

E.O. 12958: N/A
TAGS: PREL PHUM KIRF VM RELFREE HUMANR
SUBJECT: AMBASSADOR MEETS WITH RELIGIOUS AFFAIRS COMMITTEE
CHAIRMAN

Refs: A. State 157575; B. Hanoi 2267; C. HCMC 1009; D. HCMC
1024

SUMMARY
-------

1. (SBU) The Ambassador met September 29 with Committee on
Religious Affairs Chairman Ngo Yen Thi to present Ref A
points (previously provided to Vice Foreign Minister Le Van
Bang) and discuss the religious freedom situation in
Vietnam. Although there has been great progress, problems
remain, and we are concerned about recent incidents, such as
a church burning in Quang Ngai Province, illegal seizures of
land belonging to Hmong Protestants in the Northwest
Highlands and problems involving a foreigners' church group
in HCMC, the Ambassador explained. Chairman Thi showed a
positive attitude to responding to these specific cases and
readily acknowledged that local authorities often do not
follow Vietnam's laws and regulations. He cited Gia Lai
Province in the Central Highlands as a model for other
localities there. The Chairman also explained that there
will be forward movement in the church registration and
recognition processes towards the end of the year or early
next year. End Summary.

Much Progress...
----------------

2. (SBU) The Ambassador met September 29 with Ngo Yen Thi,
Chairman of the GVN's Committee on Religious Affairs (CRA).
Pol/C also attended. Drawing on points contained in Refs A
and B, the Ambassador outlined the many areas in the
bilateral relationship that have improved in the decade
since normalization, not least our bilateral discussions on
religious freedom. Thanks to the efforts of the CRA, this
past year in particular has seen important progress, with
the GVN going to considerable lengths to clarify its
religion policies and expand the space for religious belief.
This progress, and our bilateral efforts that culminated in
the May 5 exchange of letters, helped to set the stage for
Prime Minister Phan Van Khai's successful visit to
Washington and meeting with President Bush, at which the
President described the exchange of letters as a "landmark
agreement." The USG fully recognizes that the space for
religious belief and practice is expanding in Vietnam, the
Ambassador emphasized.

...But Problems Remain
----------------------

3. (SBU) That said, several positive legal reforms remain in
their initial stages and a number of significant problems
are of concern to the United States, the Ambassador
continued. One key problem area is that local authorities
are still not consistently implementing Vietnam's legal
framework on religion. Although a formal decision has not
yet been made, under these conditions, it will be difficult
to lift Vietnam's designation as a Country of Particular
Concern (CPC) for religious freedom violations. As
indicated to Vice Foreign Minister Le Van Bang (Ref B), one
way for both sides to narrow their differences and identify
areas of agreement is for the GVN to provide in six months'
time a province-by-province assessment of the state of
religious freedom, the Ambassador explained.

General Areas of Concern
------------------------

4. (SBU) Providing Ref A's list problem areas (in
Vietnamese) to Chairman Thi, the Ambassador paraphrased our
general concerns:

-- 1) A number of individuals remain in prison because of
their religious activities. Although our list continues to
shrink, thanks both to amnesties and the solid information
we received from the GVN that some of our prisoners of
concern were not in jail for religious reasons, we still
know of two individuals who are in prison for reasons
connected to their faith (see para 15 for the list provided
to Chairman Thi);

-- 2) Better training and supervision of local officials are
necessary to ensure consistent implementation of Vietnam's
legal framework on religion;

-- 3) We continue to receive reports -- although fewer than
before -- about forced renunciations and physical assaults
on believers. These attract a great deal of attention in
the United States and elsewhere;

-- 4) Providing opportunities for religious training is key
because well-trained religious workers can help to ensure
that believers and their practices are accepted in their
communities;
-- 5) and, the legalization of congregations and re-
establishment of house churches are critical issues, but
this is still a disappointing area, and the pace of church
reopenings is slow.

Recent Problem Areas
--------------------

5. (SBU) Turning to specific examples of recent problem
areas, the Ambassador expressed surprise about reports that
Chairman Thi's Committee plans to turn down the registration
applications of the Mennonite and 7th Day Adventist
churches. If true, this would be disappointing and
difficult to understand. The Ambassador noted that we are
also aware that, on August 21, a house church in Quang Ngai
Province was burned down by a local veterans group after the
religious followers refused to renounce their faith (Ref C).
Our ConGen HCMC has raised this issue with local
authorities, but has not yet received a response, the
Ambassador said.

6. (SBU) Another incident that has come to our attention
involves a number of Hmong Protestants in Lao Cai Province,
in the northwest, who reportedly had their land illegally
seized because of their religious beliefs, the Ambassador
continued. We sent a letter to the Lao Cai People's
Committee Chairman asking about this matter, with a copy to
the CRA's Chairman Thi. We recognize that tensions will
exist at the village level between believers and non-
believers, and this can be difficult to manage. But,
Vietnamese law is clear, and people have the freedom either
to believe or not to believe, and each should not interfere
with the other. Finally, we are concerned about the
inability of a major Protestant church group for foreigners
in HCMC to meet in a local hotel for Sunday services (Ref
D). Our ConGen has also raised this issue with HCMC
authorities, and we hope that the CRA will be able to solve
this before it becomes an even bigger problem, the
Ambassador stressed.

7. (SBU) Thanking the Ambassador for his thoughts and his
praise for the CRA, Chairman Thi noted that his Committee
has to take care not to "stand out too much," as doing so
can sometimes make it difficult to implement GVN legal
documents and directives. The CRA sees its function as to
provide advice to Vietnam's leaders and to serve as an
intermediary between the GVN and religious groups. For the
CRA, the two key issues are the promulgation of new laws and
regulations and, subsequently, figuring out how to breathe
life into them. In paying attention to these issues, the
CRA has had a particular focus on Protestants in the Central
Highlands. There is now a training course for local
officials (down to the district level) so that they
understand the Prime Minister's Instruction on Protestantism
and what steps need to be taken vis-a-vis Protestants. The
CRA also requires local authorities that are "doing well" to
draft "model reports" for others to follow, Chairman Thi
explained.

8. (SBU) Over the past several months, there has been much
progress in the Central Highlands, with Gia Lai Province
doing a particularly good job, the Chairman continued. Gia
Lai authorities are implementing the Prime Minister's
Instruction, and ten more Protestant congregations have
registered there. Gia Lai has also permitted the Southern
Evangelical Church of Vietnam (SECV) to conduct a training
course for 46 pastors. Elsewhere in the Central Highlands,
such as in Dak Lak, Dak Nong, Kon Tum and Lam Dong
Provinces, there has also been progress, Chairman Thi said.
However, improvements in the various provinces are unequal
because of "different levels of awareness among local
officials." For its part, the CRA needs to understand why
some local authorities do not fully understand GVN policy,
such as the Prime Minister's Instruction. To that end, the
CRA is monitoring the situation in the Central Highlands,
providing guidance and direction to local authorities and
preparing to enact "further steps" for even further
improvements on the ground, Chairman Thi explained.

9. (SBU) The CRA is also focusing its efforts on the
Ordinance on Religion and Belief (and its Implementing
Decree) to facilitate the registration of and religious
practice by certain groups, Thi continued. "Hopefully later
this year or early next year there will be more improvements
to allow religious groups to register their activities," he
said. Although unregistered groups are carrying out their
activities "as normal," it is important for them to receive
recognition from the Central Government so that local
authorities recognize that these groups are acting within
the law. Because of a lack of recognition, religious
groups' activities are often misunderstood as illegal, and
local authorities have taken action to prevent them.
Therefore, the key is to speed up the
registration/recognition process with the hope that there
will be further improvements in the days ahead.

10. (SBU) Incidents of forced renunciations have declined
considerably, but there is often still "disharmony" between
believers and non-believers or local authorities, the
Chairman acknowledged. However, there are some cases that
on the surface appear to involve discrimination or forced
renunciations, but, in fact, are family feuds. On the
specific issue of the land issue in Lao Cai Province,
Chairman Thi acknowledged receipt of the copy of the
Ambassador's letter and said that he sent CRA officers to
the area to investigate and report.

11. (SBU) On the subject of the foreigners' religious group
in HCMC (the New Life Fellowship), Chairman Thi said that he
sent written instructions to the HCMC CRA to provide
guidance to the group on how to register their religious
activities. Hotels are not religious places, and if the
group wants to use a Vietnamese place of worship, it only
needs to register with the proper authorities. This kind of
case seems unusual for HCMC, which is normally more
"flexible," and Chairman Thi surmised that it may just
involve some procedural problem. On the Quang Ngai church-
burning case, Chairman Thi said this was the first he heard
of it and pledged to investigate.

12. (SBU) The religious situation in Vietnam continues to
improve, Chairman Thi averred. However, while we have to
recognize that there will be problems, we cannot let
individual incidents color our overall perception of the
situation. The Chairman concluded by promising to continue
to work with the Ambassador and the Embassy to further
promote progress.

13. (SBU) The Ambassador agreed that breathing life into
Vietnam's laws and regulations is a key challenge, and that,
while there has been progress, challenges remain,
particularly in the registration and recognition process.
Incidents will occur, but information sharing can help to
ameliorate this, and the Ambassador promised to continue to
keep Chairman Thi informed of incidents and problems that
come to our attention. Gia Lai Province is indeed a model
for others, and we hope that the GVN and the CRA can
convince Dak Lak Province and others to pay attention to how
Gia Lai handles issues related to religious freedom.
Thanking the Chairman for the information on the New Life
Fellowship, the Ambassador noted that, although HCMC may
seem to be more flexible on certain matters, other problems
in the past, notably involving the Mennonites and Pastor
Quang, show that sometimes even the most progressive local
authorities need help to get back on the right path.

14. (SBU) Comment: Chairman Thi showed a refreshing
willingness to acknowledge shortfalls in some areas,
particularly the gaps between the Central Government and
local authorities and the slowness of the registration
process. Moreover, we are in full agreement with his
assessment of Gia Lai Province as an oasis of
progressiveness in the Central Highlands. We will continue
to work with Chairman Thi and his CRA to share information
and bring problem areas to their attention. End Comment.

15. (SBU) List of prisoners provided to Chairman Thi of
Vietnamese citizens who are imprisoned for reasons related
to their religious views.

Begin list:

Tran Van Hoang: Hoa Thoi Village, Dinh Thanh Commune, Thoai
Son District, An Giang Province. Forty-seven-year-old Hoa
Hao Buddhist, detained on February 25, 2005, and sentenced
to nine months' imprisonment for distributing audio
cassettes and DVDs with religious teachings on them.

Ma Van Bay: Ha Giang Prvovince. A Protestant church
leader, B?y was allegedly arrested in 1997 and charged with
theft after collecting voluntary donations for church use.
Bay escaped from custody and lived for several years in Binh
Phuoc Province. In November 2003, he was allegedly arrested
again and returned to Ha Giang and sentenced to six years'
imprisonment on April 28, 2004.

End list.
MARINE

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