Tourism Minister not in favour of taxing visitors
Tourism Minister not in favour of taxing visitors - 'We're really expensive to visit'
Deputy Prime Minister and Minister of Tourism Paula Bennett says she is not keen on a tourist or hotel tax.
Speaking on Q+A this morning, Ms Bennett said: “I’m personally not a big fan,” she said. “Because we’re really expensive to visit.”
Speaking as Police Minister, Ms Bennett said a government plan to increase police numbers by 880 over the next four years was aimed at reducing the crime rate and she said the move “should bring it down.”
“The aim is to have faster response and to prevent crime. It actually takes a lot of resource to work with some of our most dysfunctional families.”
She was also asked about fellow party members Nikki Kaye’s and Maggie Barry’s attacks on Labour’s Deputy Leader Jacinda Adern in the Parliament last month.
“It’s funny that it’s seen as an attack on her, and I don’t really think it was, and it was certainly no harder than I’ve had in my time,” she said.
“It’s politics and you’ve got to be able to stand up and stand on your record and for what you believe in.”
END
Please find attached the full
transcript of the interviews and here are the links to both
parts of the interview Tourism and Police.
Q +
A
Episode
4
PAULA
BENNETT
Interviewed by JESSICA
MUTCH
JESSICA 2019 will be the
China-New Zealand year of tourism. The drive for more
Chinese visitors to New Zealand was announced during the
visit of the Chinese premier this week. China is already our
second biggest visitor market, with a record 400,000 Chinese
visiting last year. But with local councils already
struggling with tourist demand, I asked Paula Bennett if she
thought our infrastructure could cope with
more.
PAULA Yeah,
our big focus now is on not so much the quantity but the
quality of those that are coming, and I mean that in the way
as to how much they spend, where they visit and that they
stay a bit longer. And that’s something that the
Chinese— they’re great visitors to New
Zealand.
JESSICA Because
they’re big spenders,
right?
PAULA They
are. They’re bigger than the average spend, they’re
coming a long way, so they stay a bit longer, and you can
just see the benefits really being felt throughout New
Zealand. So, yes, there will be more Chinese visitors, but
as we say, we like them as visitors, we like how they spend
their money here, and we think we can give them a unique
experience.
JESSICA What
about our infrastructure, though? Should they be
contributing to those toilets, to the car parks that we need
with more visitor
numbers?
PAULA Yeah,
there definitely is a challenge and some strain on
infrastructure, and as a consequence, I don’t think it—
It certainly does go to those sorts of facilities like
toilets, car parking, in some places sewerage and others.
And that’s why we’ve got the mid-sized facility fund
that we’ve already spent 3 million. We’ve just opened up
another 5.5 million.
JESSICA Because
that’s not a huge amount of money, is
it?
PAULA No, but
it actually goes quite a long way. And that’s not going to
be it, I must add. Even with the first 3 million, we were
able to do 14 different projects. This 5.5 you’d be
expecting another, kind of, 20 projects. And then we’ve
got more money, and we’re looking at what we do in the
Budget. There’s also strain on DOC, and I think that New
Zealanders are feeling that a
bit.
JESSICA So
will we see more money in that 5.5 million pot that local
governments can apply to have things that they need? Will we
see an announcement before the
election?
PAULA Well,
look, we’re certainly working our way through a budget
process as we speak. And that’s where TIA and Local
Government New Zealand put out their, kind of, wish list, if
you like, which looked very long, I’ve got to say, and not
all of what would fit in with what we would consider to be
core tourism infrastructure. But we recognise that there is
a need, and we recognise that government has a role to play
in helping to fund some of that so that everyone feels the
benefits and not just
pain.
JESSICA What
about a tourist tax or a hotel
tax?
PAULA I’m
personally not a big
fan.
JESSICA How
come?
PAULA Because
we’re really expensive to visit. We’re already in
different surveys that you look
at.
JESSICA But if
these are wealthy tourists that we’re trying to attract
that we talk about, couldn’t they afford a little tax on
the
side?
PAULA Yeah,
but we don’t want to be— I mean, I don’t mind us being
expensive at all. I think that we are unique. We’ve got,
you know, just the best package in the world to deliver to
them. But we don’t want to be seen as a rip-off, and
that’s when it can start turning pretty quickly. So they
do contribute a lot through GST and what they’re paying
here. Everyone is benefitting — 188,000 people employed in
the industry. Now that growing over $40 billion spend. Gosh,
I was in Matamata this week, and you could see there from
2009 to now $100 million annually extra going in because of
tourism. So that’s signifcant for that district.
JESSICA We’ve
got to be careful, though, don’t we? Because it’s got to
be a balance of quantity versus quality. Because if you’ve
got hundreds of thousands of tourists flooding in, they
don’t want to be standing next to 26 German tourists when
they take a photo; they want that unique New Zealand
experience. How do we make sure we’re just attracting
those rich tourists who stay for a long
time?
PAULA We
don’t want to be just exclusively for rich either. I mean,
I love that people— you know, we have some that do the
backpacker and the working visas and they travel, and then
they come back when they are wealthy and enjoy our country
again and they’re more likely to visit different regions
and things, which spreads that money around. But I do agree
on the quantity now is not such a big focus for us. So as I
say, we spend all our time thinking about whom we’re
attracting, trying to get them to stay for longer and visit
the regions. When it comes to DOC, though, the point you
make is exactly right. I do think it’s New Zealanders that
get a little bit more antsy about standing on a track with a
thousand other people. But actually a lot of the
international tourists, they think that’s the norm and not
busy.
JESSICA Yeah,
we’ve seen examples of that on the show as well where on
Tongariro, for example, you’ve got to queue up to get up.
What impact are all these tourists having on our national
parks, and do we need to be careful of
that?
PAULA Yes, we
do, definitely. DOC have done some really neat work in how
they’ve put extra facilities in, particularly over this
summer, so that they can do some work with freedom camping.
What you’re talking about, though, is we’ve got a lot of
people visiting just a few of our Great Walks or short
walks, and we don’t think they know about the others. So
we’re working on campaigns that get them going to
different places. When you look at Tongariro, which is a
great example, the practical girl in me went, ‘Oh, let’s
do more car parking, and let’s do get those toilets in.’
And the local community and iwi and DOC are getting together
and going, ‘Actually, we can do it smarter than that.’
And they are working together what might look like more
people getting shuttled to the bottom, which means
businesses are getting money, they’re going to buy their
coffee in Ohakune or Ruapehu, which means that the shuttle
business gets, you know… And so I think there’s
different ways in which we can manage that growth.
JESSICA What about
just restricting numbers,
though?
PAULA Well,
that might restrict numbers if you can’t actually just get
to the bottom of it and park; you’ve got to go by shuttle
or something. That might be a way of restricting numbers
that actually means that everyone gets a great experience
when they do it.
JESSICA Might
annoy New Zealanders, though, do you
think?
PAULA And
that’s the point. New Zealanders want access and
should have access to our DOC estate. So I think there is
work for us to be doing in making sure that we are
advertising other walks and other experiences that you can
have in New Zealand. It’s not just the only day walk that
you can do; there’s a whole lot of them. So DOC are
working really hard with Tourism and with local government
to work on — and iwi –what those might look like.
JESSICA Because
you mentioned freedom campers, which is obviously a very hot
topic at the moment. They’ve been labelled feral campers
by some over the last couple of weeks. How do we deal with
that problem when we say, ‘Come on over. Come and
spend.’ And then they’re in the hotels, and it pushes
these freedom campers out on to the streets.
PAULA Yeah, a
couple of things. So the first thing I want to really
staunchly do is differentiate between those that are here in
motor vans and motorhomes. They actually spend more. The
average spend for travellers is around 3200. Their spend is
5200. They are actually wonderful visitors to New
Zealanders.
JESSICA Most of
the time.
PAULA No,
all of the— Well, I can’t say all of
them.
JESSICA Some
of them.
PAULA Most
of them are very, very respectful. Then there’s what I
would then term freedom campers. They are the ones that are
coming over and either buying a cheap car or going in these
non-self-contained motorhomes and getting around and
actually not treating our environment as respectfully as we
want. So the first thing is providing more freedom camping
spaces for them. Local Government, DOC, Tourism, we’re
working really hard on that and making a big difference. And
I do think we need better education as to what’s
acceptable in New Zealand and not. But some of the behaviour
we’ve seen, there’s been toilets literally metres away
and they haven’t used them. I mean, that’s just
appalling, quite frankly.
[ADVERT BREAK]
JESSICA And we’re back with our
extended interview with Paula Bennett, this time in her role
as Police Minister. Judith Collins had a reputation when
she was the minister for being on the side of police when
you’ve come into the job is it something you feel like you
have to replicate or did you need to do a bit of a shake-up
what was your stance coming in?
PAULA I got the
portfolio because I just have such a deep admiration for
police, for what they do on the front line, for the
difference that they make. As a Minister of Social
Development, we worked really closely with them and Child,
Youth and Family, really closely with them in domestic
violence. Of course I know my local police, as you do always
as an electorate MP. And so my admiration— And, I tell
you, it’s gone up since being minister. How hard they work
– their dedication – is just extraordinary. So that was
easy. I had it before I got the job. And it is honestly a
privilege to be their minister, and I just— I see my role
as their support person, to be quite honest. I mean, they
know what drives— what’s needed to be done in our
communities; they know how to prevent crime, and I just want
to support them in that however I
can.
JESSICA And
perhaps while you’re announcing more of them, because part
of the announcement this year – 880 over the next four
years. That’s 220 a year. Do--? That’s a big
boost.
PAULA Yeah.
JESSICA Does
it show that National’s undercooked on policing numbers
for the last nine
years?
PAULA No,
because we’ve done, actually, the equivalent of almost
more than that in the last eight years. And, I mean, the
technology advances that they got as far as the tablets and
the freeing up of police hours was huge – 600 extra
police.
JESSICA But
this is a big boost,
though.
PAULA Yeah,
it is. So, look, I wouldn’t say catch-up, but I would say
that we needed to look at what was needed over the next four
years, and we went through a really robust process of
actually doing a business case alongside of that, because I
didn’t just want to throw more police numbers in. I wanted
it to be making a significant difference to our communities,
and that’s what I think this package
delivers.
JESSICA You
don’t want to use the word ‘catch-up’, but, I guess,
70,000 people are coming into New Zealand each year . Over
the next four years, will we have to adjust those
numbers?
PAULA Well,
I mean, I’m not going to talk— I can talk about
immigration if you like, but there’s no doubt about it
that we’ve had a population increase, and as a consequence
of that, then we need more front-line services, as we do in
health and education and in police as well, so, you know,
that is part of why we increased the
numbers.
JESSICA You
talked about other solutions as well. These boost of police
numbers coming in – is the end game to reduce crime? And
is there evidence that this will do it? By having more
police on the street, it’ll bring the crime rate
down?
PAULA Yeah,
so, absolutely the aim is to have faster response and to
prevent crime. This— And it actually takes a lot of
resource to work with some of our most dysfunctional
families.
JESSICA Will
it bring it down,
though?
PAULA It
should bring it down. It’s absolutely our game, and our—
the goal, sorry, with the Police Commissioner is to be
reducing crime. I mean, these police are in the homes of our
most dysfunctional families – more than anyone else in our
highest-crime families. They often don’t have the time,
because they are busy and are going to the next job, to
actually make sure that there is the follow-up, and the work
that needs to be done in many, many different cases, they
will be able to do that. So, like, one of the goals was to
reduce truancy. Well, that’s not normally the job of
police, but they know that by making sure that kids are in
school that that means that they’re less likely to prev—
to be doing crimes, and so that’s another prevention
measure.
JESSICA Because
that’s one of the side things, because it feels sometimes
like just putting more police numbers, it’s the ambulance
at the bottom of the cliff. But some of those things do work
more. How do you balance that as minister to get that right?
How do you get that advice in and say, ‘Right, this is
what we need. 220 will make a difference and will bring it
down’?
PAULA Yeah,
as I say, a lot of work over summer. It’s kind of what I
spent January doing was really drilling into that. Domestic
violence is another area – you know, 110 call-outs for
police each year, them then having a bit of time to spend
with the family and have the follow-up over the next few
days.
JESSICA I
want to ask you about small towns as well – regional
centres. You’ve had a bit of attention on this in the last
few days. You’ve had Thames, where it was quite an
interesting public meeting, where they laid out their
concerns. We’ve seen Kaikohe as well with the young boys
trying to get into the service station. Will these regions
get a boost from some of these police numbers? Because the
message they’re sending out is they’re not feeling super
safe at the
moment.
PAULA Yeah.
So, all of them— So all districts are getting an increase.
The Commissioner will be making announcements about that in
the upcoming weeks, because he’s been going through the
area commanders and working out exactly where they will be
going to. But certainly areas like that will see an increase
in the number of front-line police
officers.
JESSICA Because—
You’ll call me a cynical journalist for asking this
question, but it seems in election year, to be able to say
this to all those concerns, ‘Don’t worry, guys.
Cavalry’s on the way,’ it must make your job a little
bit easier for the next five months – being able to say
that when people raise these
concerns.
PAULA Well,
it just means that we listened to them, have seen a need
and, as any responsible government is, that we’ve
responded to it.
JESSICA Do you feel
sympathy for these guys who feel like in the regions
they’ve been left alone a
bit?
PAULA I
just— I feel like they’ve got a unique set of
circumstances that they’re trying to deal with, but I can
tell you they feel it in Auckland and they feel it in
Wellington as well, so it’s not just a rural kind of
issue. 140 of those officers, though, would be exclusively
rural, which I think’s really
important.
JESSICA I
want to ask about pay as well, because the time’s going
past so quickly. But in terms of police wages, do you feel
in Auckland that there could be a special wage for cops to
live here so that they’d stay on in the
police?
PAULA Well,
I mean that gets really difficult, because you’ve just
identified that places like Thames and Kaikohe want more
police as
well.
JESSICA Could
you give them an allowance
too?
PAULA So,
yeah, you’re sort of saying everyone should get an
allowance, and we pretty much do that every year because
police get a pay increase, and they had quite a reasonable
one last year that we’re still going to be paying
off.
JESSICA Auckland’s
tough, though, isn’t it, with the housing market at the
moment?
PAULA Yeah,
but then some of our rural communities are trying to attract
police there as well, and that’s a different set of
challenging circumstances. So I don’t want to play
Auckland off against the rest of the country, and I’m not
convinced at this stage that they should be getting more pay
than other
police.
JESSICA I
want to ask you a deputy leadership question now. We saw
Jacinda Ardern come newly into the position. There was an
attack, if you like, or some strong words form Nikki Kaye
and Maggie Barry. Do you regret the way that that played
out?
PAULA Yeah,
it’s funny that it’s seen as an attack on her, and I
don’t really think it was, and it was certainly no harder
than I’ve had in my time. My goodness, I remember my first
year as a minister, and they said, ‘We’re going for
her.’ You know? Yeah, Labour thought I was a weak link,
and they went for
me.
JESSICA Did you
feel sorry for her, then, in that
way?
PAULA No,
it’s politics, and you’ve got to be able to stand up and
stand on your record and stand up for what you believe in,
and I just think that that’s, you
know—
JESSICA I
mean, using words like ‘superficial’, ‘cosmetic’,
‘facelift’, that feels like a little bit of a dig to her
as a woman. Don’t you think? Did that irk you a
bit?
PAULA I
don’t know. Winston Peters called me fat in public many
times, and I’ve decided to ignore it and move on, so,
look, it’s not always fair, and I don’t always think we
like what we say sometimes and that sort of thing, but it is
pretty robust, and we’ve got to be able to stick up for
ourselves and concentrate on what
matters.
JESSICA Do
you think it should be kept professional, though? It should
be--?
PAULA Of
course it should, and we all should be, and we’re all not
perfect all of the time, but I think that Jacinda stepped
into a really big role. She’s obviously really enjoying
it. I see her most days, and in that capacity, good on her
and go for it.
JESSICA Are you targeting
her because National’s a bit
worried?
PAULA Nah,
she’s fine. Look, what Labour does with their leadership
and everything else is really their business, and we’ll
stick to ours and what we’re trying to deliver for New
Zealanders.