Tuesday 3rd May, 2011

TRANSCRIPT: Labour Leader, Phil Goff interviewed on TV ONE’s Breakfast at 7:20am this morning.

The full length video interview can also be seen on tvnz.co.nz at, http://tvnz.co.nz/Breakfast

PHIL GOFF interviewed by CORIN DANN

Corin: Good morning Mr Goff are you celebrating the death of Osama Bin Laden?

Phil: I don’t know whether celebrating is the right word in terms of anybody's death, but I think the world's a better place for it, and I very clearly welcome the justice that this brings finally to the families of those thousands of victims in New York and elsewhere that were the result of Bin Laden's attack on innocent civilians. That’s a good thing.

Corin: Indeed I wonder what you think it means for the operation in Afghanistan. Do you think this will signal that perhaps Obama might be about to start pulling back a little bit there, so perhaps by extension New Zealand's involvement could also be reduced?

Phil: I think that it allows the United States to claim that an exit strategy is now more appropriate, notwithstanding the fact that Al Qaeda and the Taliban actually don’t have that closer links, despite the public impression of that.

Corin: Yeah that’s an important distinction actually. So it's a different fight in some ways isn't it?

Phil: Yeah look the Taliban were originally guilty of hosting Al Qaeda on Afghan territory, and that was the cause of the conflict in Afghanistan, but the two organisations are quite separate, Al Qaeda now operating more out of Pakistan and Yemen than out of Afghanistan. I think it will raise more questions about why we have the international forces in Afghanistan, particularly given the corrupt nature of the regime there.

Corin: Well let's just stay with that for a second, because yesterday the Prime Minister made some comments about this investigation by journalist Jon Stevenson as to whether New Zealand SAS troops should have handed over prisoners and the way in which they may have been treated by US forces. You have concerns about this, you want an inquiry but I also want to know your opinion on John Key attacking the journalists here as well, was that justified?

Phil: Well let's look at the issue, the allegations have been made, they're quite serious allegations that we were in breach of international obligations on us in terms of handing prisoners over. Look I can't comment on the reliability of what the journalist has said.

Corin: But you'd be familiar with Jon Stevenson though wouldn’t you? I mean he's been around for many years, he's been in Iraq, he's been all over the place.

Phil: I am, but I'm wanting to focus not on the personality but on the issue. Wayne Mapp said I think nine months ago that he would produce a report on allegations that had been made that we were passing prisoners across that were going to be ultimately in the custody of the Afghan Secret Police, and therefore liable to torture. That report has never been produced, there are unanswered questions. I think it's best to clear this matter up. I have no prejudice against the SAS at all, in fact I have complete confidence that they will have behaved appropriately. The question is, were prisoners passed across to Afghan authorities who could not be relied upon not to torture those suspects.

Corin: So you want - an independent inquiry is needed here to clear this up once and for all?

Phil: Yeah it doesn’t have to be a big deal but it might be a figure seen to be independent from the Defence Force and the government, maybe a judicial figure that can go through the material that’s on file to determine whether New Zealanders in fact are acting in accordance with its international obligations, or has been in breach of them. I think that matter could be done quite clearly, and it would remove the cloud that these allegations have created for the Governor General elect, Jerry Mataparae. I'm sure that he'd like to have that matter cleared up.

Corin: Have you made a decision yet on whether you will stand against Hone Harawira?

Phil: No that’s a matter that I'll be discussing with my caucus and then later with the New Zealand Council of the Labour Party. What I've said quite clearly is that I would not be entering into a supply and confidence agreement with Hone Harawira. I don’t regard him as reliable, I think his conduct time and again has shown that. I intend to lead a stable coalition government. Secondly, his policies and his values are often quite different from those of the Labour Party. In some areas I feel very strongly about that, about comments that he makes that he wouldn’t want his kids to go out with Pakehas etcetera, that’s not my New Zealand. But you know if Hone Harawira were re-elected and wanted to support Labour's policy for upskilling our young people, for reducing Maori unemployment, for improving our standard of living, of course he's free to support those policies.

Corin: But he doesn’t seem to think you'll be around.

Phil: Yes well he might think that, but that’s what you expect the leader of a party that I've already ruled out as having any credibility as a coalition partner might say.

Corin: Phil Goff, Opposition Leader, thank you very much for your time.

ENDS

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